User talk:Scarecroe
Hey Hey Scott, Thanks for the welcome! Glad to be here.Seotommy 18:26, 17 November 2006 (UTC) Frustrated Scarecroe, Regarding my Minor Muppet Mentions's addition being deleted. I understand the removal of The Breakup, of course, because it's already mentioned elsewhere. But the Muppets are directly mentioned in both Brooke Shields' book and Billy Joel's song. A Muppet mention, which is exactly the title and purpose of this page. Especially interesting to me as a Muppet fan is for MuppetFest/Muppets Live to be mentioned as such an important moment in Brooke's life as written in her book (and excerpted here). Why would this not be "Muppet relevant"? The song Pressure (which has Sesame Street in the lyrics) and Brooke's book mention seem exactly appropriate to belonging, at least somewhere, in this Wiki. Thanks. Jeff Epstein. :Hi, Jeff. I didn't remove the Billy Joel song, I just alphabetized it. And, The Break-Up wasn't a Muppet mention, the producers just used a song that came from a Muppet movie, so that's mentioned on the appropriate page. :The information about Brooke Shields having a miscarriage doesn't have anything to do with the Muppets. I'm sure that if every celebrity wrote a book about their lives, they'd mention something about their collaboartion with the Muppets. (Maybe Steve Martin couldn't get rid of an erection while in England shooting The Muppet Show.) But 1) that's hardly what that is in Shields' book, and 2) I wouldn't see the point of listing them all on that page. We already know they were connected to the Muppets because we have an article here for them categorized under Celebrities. Under other circumstances, I'd suggest moving the information to her article here, but I don't see what Brooke Shields' dead baby has to do with Muppet Wiki. — Scott (talk) 16:42, 17 November 2006 (UTC) ::Every time you put work a dead baby into the Muppet Wiki, an angel gets it's wings, Daveyyy... ::lol...Anyway the inclusion of that information has no actual Muppet connection: she found out once her performance was over, thus, she left the Muppets, and so did the incident. The fact that she was featured in The Muppet Show Live is mentioned in its correct place on her article. As for her referencing her time with the Muppets in her book, that is inclusion-worthy information. If it can be paraphrased, it would most likely also belong on her individual article. That'd be something worth picking out of other memoirs like you mentioned Scott (and I'm going to go rifling through Steve Martin autobiographies just hoping for that specific info now). I'd say bits like that definitely warrant inclusion if they represent unique information otherwise unlisted - but it should go on their own pages rather than in Minor Muppet Mentions, I'd say. --Cantus Rock 18:02, 17 November 2006 (UTC) :::Scarecore: I believe it is relevant, but you don't think it is. Okay. Sorry I didn't look carefully enough for "Pressure". Regarding when Brooke found out, it was right before singing with Kermit in the live show. Here's a quote from the excerpt: December 2001. I’m standing in the wings of the Palace Theatre in Hollywood, California, for MuppetFest, which is a tribute to Jim Henson as well as a fund-raiser for Save the Children...Now, while I’m waiting for my cue, my cell phone rings. The news is not good. My doctor says, "I’m sorry, but the pregnancy is no longer viable." Jeff epstein 18:18, 17 November 2006 (UTC) Ernie and Bert Sketches Wonderful work cleaning up the Ernie and Bert sketch pages. You're my hero! I love the header template you've come up with. I had been meaning to get around to cleaning the pages up, but laziness kept winning over. Cookie Monster and Grover Sketches have many of the same problems and help needed, but this is a great step in the right direction. Great work. -- Brad D. (talk) 09:22, 16 November 2006 (UTC) :Thanks! I'm gonna want to wait a while to do Cookie and Grover. I want to make sure that everything goes smoothly with Ernie and Bert. — Scott (talk) 09:24, 16 November 2006 (UTC) ::I love it. Those are great pictures in the header! Oooh, this coffee table book is getting better all the time. -- Danny (talk) 02:39, 17 November 2006 (UTC) Bells Ringing Hi Scott -- do you happen to know which version of "I Heard the Bells on Christmas Day" is in Muppet Family Christmas?? My memory is the Johnny Marks 1950's version (like Bing Crosby & Frank Sinatra sing), which is generally more popular (and melodic), but that could be a personal preference coloring my memory and I can't get at my tape. The other version is by John Baptiste Calkin and I have no idea who might have recorded it ever; it's a bit faster and much more hymn-like. -- Wendy (talk) 05:08, 16 November 2006 (UTC) :I'll peak around on Amazon and see if I can find some sound samples, but for now I can tell you that it's the one that goes "I heard the bells on Christmas Day, Thier old familiar carols play, And wild and sweet the words repeat, Of peace on earth, goodwill to men." Although, I'm betting both tunes used the same lyrics, huh? Um, I can hum it for you... image:tongue.gif — Scott (talk) 05:15, 16 November 2006 (UTC) ::yah... One poem, two melodies; officially Johnny Marks "adapted" the poem a little, but not much. I can actually hum both versions for some reason (they are now running in my head) and kept wishing I could do that when writing the question. Though it's pretty easy to find Bing & Frank singing christmasy stuff on amazon (that's what I did to make sure; I just was too lazy to go back and figure out the links to copy here). The real problem is that I now want to watch the darn special and I can't! -- Wendy (talk) 05:32, 16 November 2006 (UTC) :::Huh. That was harder than I thought. Anyway, this is the one: http://cdsampler.com/mp3.cgi/07674259922al.mp3 — Scott (talk) 05:41, 16 November 2006 (UTC) ::::Johnny Marks it is. That's good to know for sure. I didn't realize it would be hard for you to find a clip - sorry about that. Although the amazon stuff I had found was the middle of the song (not the beginning part you found/quoted) and windows media format so it might not have helped you much anyhow. Off to fill in the info. Thanks! -- Wendy (talk) 05:47, 16 November 2006 (UTC) Gund Puppets I saw you just added some Sesame Street Gund puppets, and thought you might want to check these out... 2.5-foot tall full body Sesame puppets. -- Brad D. (talk) 03:55, 16 November 2006 (UTC) :Holy crap, those are awesome -- and Gund made them! — Scott (talk) 03:57, 16 November 2006 (UTC) ::Yeah, they are sweet. Apparently there are also Oscar and Count ones too. -- Brad D. (talk) 03:59, 16 November 2006 (UTC) Heads up Either it's a pure coincidence that User:Donessimo1 is reminiscent of a recently banned user, or he's finally smart enough to include a fake name like "Fred Howard," but still too stupid to fully relinquish any variant of his name. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:07, 16 November 2006 (UTC) :Yep, it's Dean. His response to Name That Puppet is typical and clinches it, a name with no explanation or context of where it came from. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:12, 16 November 2006 (UTC) ::Classic Dean. — Scott (talk) 01:13, 16 November 2006 (UTC) You rule The Sam page is so beautiful now. -- Danny (talk) 19:41, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :Yeah, I'm really glad we came up with the gallery thing for disambig pages. It works out really well. — Scott (talk) 19:42, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::Yeah, I'm glad that you guys have been getting the disambigs all standardized now. They look great. -- Danny (talk) 19:57, 15 November 2006 (UTC) Another Boston Legal Connection Say hi to Tom Selleck. -- Andrew Leal (talk) :Oh, wow, that's kooky! Dave Coulier, John Ritter and Whoopie Goldberg did that for Muppet Babies, too. I wonder how many other celebrities did? — Scott (talk) 16:11, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::Yeah, it's surprising. I knew Muppet Babies used a lot of stock footage, but new clips of these celebs is surprising and interesting. I remember one episode that relied extensively on Steve Martin playing Cyrano as in Roxanne, and I'd now be curious to see whether he actually filmed new footage for it, as a promotional thing. The Museum of Broadcasting added three more Muppet Babies episodes, so they're full of odd stuff, including Baby Rowlf as Uncle Sam when Baby Piggy becomes President of the United States (for all of two seconds in a song sequence), and Rowlf name-checking Morris the Cat. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 16:16, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :::Dude, there are so many episodes of MB, and all of them are chock full of references just waiting to be farmed for the wiki. Part of me almost wants to dish out for one of those DVD bootlegs being sold on eBay (or as Oscar calls it in A Sesame Street Christmas Carol, gBay). — Scott (talk) 16:21, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::::I hear ya. The one I'm really jonesing for is Episode 606: Comic Capers. Spider-Man and Blondie and Dagwood appear as themselves, plus Baby Scooter as Popeye, and of all things, an Apartment 3-G take-off (apparently Nanny's favorite comic). And live footage of some actor as a Marvel Comics artist, trying to kick them out of Spider-Man. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 16:24, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :::::I've found some torrents for MB eps, but none of them are being seeded anymore. If I find any that are, I'll let ya know. — Scott (talk) 16:26, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::::::Thanks! And if you're curious (I'll probably post this to the Toughpigs forum as well, or current events), here's some links to stream or download- ::::::What Do You Wanna Be When You Grow Up? - with Selleck ::::::Close Encounters of the Frog Kind - introduces Baby Robin ::::::Gonzo’s Video Show- an extended Star Wars spoof, mostly. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 16:36, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :::::::Thanks! I just finished downloading those this morning along with "The Muppet Broadcasting Company." "Gonzo's Video Show" I have on DVD, so I didn't bother with that one, but they're all good to have. — Scott (talk) 16:38, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::::::::Yeah. Had I known I was going to become a Muppet Wiki addict, I'd have bought some of those Muppet Babies doll/DVD sets when they were plentiful. Of course, "Muppet Broadcasting Company" (with letters MBC, which belonged to the real Mutual Broadcasting Company) is my favorite, with all the old-time radio stuff. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 16:43, 15 November 2006 (UTC) Dean? Hey, Dean's back, as User:Deanmo19 even. Do you know if he was actually unblocked, intentionally, or is this the result of a glitch? I checked my e-mails and can't find any notice suggesting that he finally contacted Danny and promised to behave. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 02:00, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :Block log doesn't show he was unblocked. Looks like it was a glitch. — Scott (talk) 02:16, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::Should we contact Wikia about it? Infinite blocks which last less than a full month are of negligible utility, I daresay. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 02:20, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :::If you want. I'm not worried about it right away, but it could prove to be a problem. — Scott (talk) 02:29, 15 November 2006 (UTC) Santa ID Nice catch. I don't own the DVD; did you research it, or was it in fact in the credits all along, and the guys who thought it was Jerry Nelson just didn't bother to look? According to this, in addition to being a professional Santa, he's also played Ebenezer Scrooge as well. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:40, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :He's not credited on the Elmo DVD, but he finally gets his due in A Sesame Street Christmas Carol. His Happy Holidays scene is used as one of Oscar's vignettes. The name appeared in the credits under cast. It took me a few minutes to figure out who he was because there are no images on Google for him, nor does he have an IMDb listing. But sure enough, search for his name and Santa, and it's all over the place. — Scott (talk) 01:45, 15 November 2006 (UTC) Actor Galleries Okay, a few test cases for you. Miranda Richardson is the best example, but here's Peter Ustinov and Ken Campbell as well. I wouldn't recommend doing it for Jeffrey Tambor, when both of his characters have pages of their own, but I think it's useful here, as well as a better way of instantly highlighting those who have multiple Muppet and/or Creature Shop credits. In cases where there's enough text to support it, we could always add a non-Muppet headshot or something. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:07, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :Oh, I like it! And good idea about not doing galleries for characters that have their own pages. That would get tiresome. I notice you have a pretty good copy of Dreamchild... is it any good? I've been waiting for it to come out on DVD (because everything does eventually) rather than seeking out a VHS copy. — Scott (talk) 01:14, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::It's one of the few Creature Shop projects, along with Dinosaurs, which I unreservedly love and admire. A notch below Dinosaurs, as it's not wacky fun, but brilliant acting, the Creature scenes are effectively atmospheric and any grotesqueness in design and movement is in fact exactly what's *required* here; the scene where the March Hare is in terror of the Mad Hatter, enraged at his watch being slow, is a good example. I'm an admirer of Dennis Potter (The Singing Detective), and his stamp is on it in the way the narrative shifts. Plus, there's the cute little old-time radio scene, and even Peter Gallagher, eyebrows not yet as impressive at scene-stealing, is good. Some of the stereotyped New York newsroom types are tiresome, but also very brief. You'd probably enjoy the score as well. In fact, if you want a copy, just to watch, let me know, and I'll see if I can safely dupe. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:17, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :::Heh. I was just about to use Eric Clavering as another example, when I realized I'd dredged up enough info about an obscure actor with a rather wide-ranging career to justify two images, without stretching beyond the text. So there you go. One could always do the same with John Gielgud too, but as much as I admire him, there's more info available on the celebrities, than on the character actors and so on, who I have to dig deeply often to find even scraps about, building a composite. Still, I'll get around to expanding Gielgud eventually, who does deserve more than one sentence about his non-Henson work. Til then, he gets a gallery, and if some Merlin fan wants to give King Constant his own page, then he gets taken out and the Gulliver pic gets center stage. That's what I feel is the best approach. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:28, 15 November 2006 (UTC) ::::Thanks for offering! My curiosity can wait though, I think. I've got plenty of stuff to watch as it is. — Scott (talk) 01:29, 15 November 2006 (UTC) :::::I know how that is. I still haven't completely finished every skit on Old School. The offer's a standing one, though, so when you get the time and the interest, let me know. Unless it ever comes to DVD, which would be nice, since my screengrabs are a bit grainy. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:31, 15 November 2006 (UTC) Alice in Wonderland Hey, the Farscape addition (I checked, only the title is borrowed from Carroll, nought else as far as I can tell) brought something up. I'm not sure I like the way the page is currently broken up, by series or "Creature Shop," since in this case, I'd kind of like to seperate adaptations/spoofs/depictions of characters from just references (there's fewer of them, true, but in addition to Farscape, there's Sesame Street Episode 4069 (and Episode 4070), where Maria brings out a mirror/looking glass which needs to be mailed to Alice, but she can't find the zipcode for Wonderland. I'm also not sure there's really a need in this case for the multiple headings. I'm not really sure just how to re-organize it just now, though (I'm pretty tired and have to post an assignment about Whatever Happened to Baby Jane). I'll probably try to tackle it later tonight, though, so any thoughts or input would help. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 21:09, 12 November 2006 (UTC) :I'm not crazy about the way it's split up right now either. I figured the Frascape episode title was the only thing making reference, so I made sure to word it correctly. — Scott (talk) 23:10, 12 November 2006 (UTC) Cameos Again Okay, I stuck it in Sandbox for now (especially so we can decide whether to stick it in Muppet Performer Cameos or Behind the Scenes; like the connections pages, I'd vote for Behind the Scenes), but here's Muppeteers in Non-Henson Acting Roles (and if you can think of a better title, feel free). There's still plenty to add, and eventually, more pictures. John Landis or not, I'm thinking Richard Hunt's Trading Spaces role should go there, along with his one other non-Henson acting credit (Oxford Blues). I don't know if we want to do anything with the non-Henson Frank Oz Cameos (I'd say probably move), and Jim Henson's Cameo in Into the Night (which, even in contrast to Oz as Mr. Collins in An American Werewolf in London, really is just a cameo more than an acting role; he might as well be playing himself). -- Andrew Leal (talk) 05:57, 11 November 2006 (UTC) :I like it! I'll have to take a closer look at it later when I can focus on it more. — Scott (talk) 16:40, 11 November 2006 (UTC) ::Yeah, I'd appreciate your input. Michael/minor muppetz went ahead and stuck in the Hunt, Oz, and Henson cameos. I haven't removed anything from their existing pages yet, though, as I'd like your input. It seems to me the sole Hunt role in Trading Spaces (since we decided the other one didn't count as a cameo just because it wasn't directed by Landis) fits, and so do Oz' stuff, and that could all be moved with a link. But Henson's isn't an acting role so much as it *is* a cameo, with an in-joke re Bernie. If it has to be listed on the Muppeteers Acting page for completeness sake, I'd want to keep it on his cameo page as well, and same goes for the picture. The Oz pictures could probably be moved. Right now, I'm just sticking the few images I have on top, but if/when this eventually grows substantially, I'm not sure how to arrange it. We could use a bottom gallery like Miscellaneous Cameos, but I'm not sure how I feel about that. Oh, and check out Anthony Asbury from Absolutely Fabulous, as Joanna Lumley's personal trainer/boytoy. -- Andrew Leal (talk) :::I recently rented Being There, so I should soon be able to get a screenshot of Fran Brill's role. — Scott (talk) 05:31, 12 November 2006 (UTC) Book Formatting Hey, when you get a chance, take a look at User talk:Cantus Rock re Puppy Love. I personally think it's a silly issue, but then again, I felt the same re the "the" issue, and that sparked useful discussion and changes. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 21:25, 10 November 2006 (UTC) Scott's talk page archive *Muppet Wiki Talk Archives